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Cool Features

Diablo Scott's Bike Blog

Cycling Mt. Diablo

Monday, May 01, 2000

A history of klein road bikes.

97 comments:

Glad to see that there are other Klein Whores roaming the great state of CA! I am finishing my custum build on a 1994 Klein Rascal; my next project is to be a Quantum II, if I can find a size 57 frame. Nice Blog!

I love your history of these frames. I just got into cycling and i purchased a Klein Quantum in the Plum Crazy color. It's beautiful. I am having trouble figuring out what year specifically it is though. It does have a triple up front and a "i carbon" front fork and seat tube. It still has the original Vector Rolf wheels with Michelin Axial Pro's. Any idea as to the year it might be? I already love this bike, but any additional info I can find about it only makes me love it more. Thanks.

Hi D My first guess is your Quantum is a year 2000 model. That agrees with just about everything you described. Starting in 1999 they changed the way they created their serial numbers and I don't have a key for identifying them but send me a photo and your serial number and I'll add them to my very short database. Use e-mail so I can get back to you - there's a mail-to link at the top of my page.

Hey Scott: Firstly, a very cool resource - thanks. I had a circa 1989 or 1990 Black Klein Quantum with Ultegra that I deeply regret selling. I just came across a purple KQ frame (similar year I'm guessing) selling for $250. I also found a new old stock frame from 1995 that a bike shop is trying to sell for $775, although he came down to $600. In your opinion, how much should one pay for an older Klein Quantum frame? Lastly, where did you find the Priorities poster? Thanks, Bradley

I bought a 58cm 1980 custom Team Super in the summer of 1980. It was built for someone else who stiffed the dealer. I worked in a bike shop near MIT in Cambridge, MA in the spring of 1980 and a guy came in to show off his new Klein. I had worked in a bike shop in Buffalo, NY the previous summer where the owner had one so I knew something about them, which impressed this guy enough to let me take it out for a quick spin. It turned out to be more than a "quick spin" as I went ROARING up Mass Ave about a mile and a quarter to a shop called Bicycle Exchange near Harvard Square so I could show it to my cousin, who worked there. I fell in love with it immediately and knew that I would find a way to buy one. I guess the guy who owned it was fit to be tied by the time I got back with it, but my glowing praise quickly soothed his frayed nerves. When I found out that a little bike shop (I have long since forgotten the name) across Comm Ave from Boston University near the BU Bridge had a Klein frameset for sale, I had to go take a look. I guess business wasn't so great for him as he was willing to let it go for about half off its retail price. All my Campy Super Record and Dura-Ace gear came off the Holdsworth that day and the rest is history. I spent many sleepless nights machining bits off of its components and installing aluminum and titanium parts to save that last gram of weight. I even swapped out the Super Record rear changer for a Huret Jubilee. I only got it down to about 17½ lbs with 260 gram Super Champ Medaille D'Or rims (laced radial in front and three-cross/radial in back) and Clement Criterium Seta Extra silks, but I had tons of fun doing it. It was the last frame I ever bought and now it is basically a museum piece. One of these days I'll haul it out, wipe the dust off of it and shoot some pics for posterity. Henry

Thanks for the resource. I have a 1995 59" Black Klein Quantum II, 20th Anniversary Signature Model. I decided to get a carbon fork. Had to go with the Easton EC90 with 1" steerer tube as the EC70 only comes in 1-1/8". Cheers

Wow, I wish you guys would e-mail me so I could respond and ask for photos! The 1995 Quantum II would have had a threaded headset and quill stem so that should have been a pretty easy swapout of your steel fork. How's it ride? I see that's a 43mm rake and it appears to have an aero/integrated crown... how's it look too? Does the "Signature Model" have Gary's signature on it? Send photos. Click on my profile for my e-mail address.

Great resource! I appreciate the effort that went into this and just wanted to thank you for putting it up.

Hey Scott, I just got a klein stage and I have some questions. for some reason I can't click on the thing that says email you. I was wondering if you could drop me an email at [email protected] so that I could send you my questions? thanks so much, great work on the history. sig

Wow fabulous. and very informative! thank you for putting such time into creating this blog.

Hi Scott great resource! Love the page! As discussed via email, sometime next year my '93 NOS teal Quantum should be ready and I will be emailing you some pics for the blog. I really could not make a decision what component colours to use as teal is a difficult colour. I considered black, red, silver, gold but in the end decided to follow Klein's 'colour craziness' and so it will become a 'rasta' bike... Gold ano hubs, jockey wheels and headset, red ano stem, seatpost, brakes, rims and skewers, black ano handlebars, spokes and cranks....

Nice site... I really enjoyed the information. In 1996 I was working as a BBI certified wrench at a local bike shop in Atlanta and the head mechanic sold me on the idea of getting a Klein mountain bike frame. I bought a Pulse II frameset and built it out with XT components, and while I've beaten the piss out of it, it still looks like new. Sure I've upgraded a few things, but the frame is a well engineered tank with enduring looks. Interestingly, my Pulse II frame order somehow got fouled (seem to recall they ordered the wrong size) and resulted in a delay in receipt of delivery. The Klein rep felt poorly of it and offered me an irresistible deal on a Quantum II road frame (also '96). While I wasn't really in the market for another road bike (I had 4 others at the time), it was a deal I couldn't decline. So I bought it and built it out with Campy Chorus components. To date, it has logged only 3 rides! Not because I don't like it, but because it is a piece of art that I cherish. I have other road bikes to weather the abuses of regular riding. I consider myself fortunate to own 2 Klein classics. And while they don’t share the integrated headset configuration that set Klein apart in some respects, I love them just the same. I continue to abuse my Pulse II… and it still looks like new. It's nice to see there are other Klein advocates out there. - ReaknHavok

Hello Diablo Scott. Seen you in the road cycling forums too. I too, am a Klein afficiando. They are timeless machines! My first was a blue to green fade Quantum II circa 1996. That served me for 12 years and counting as my primary ride for 9 years and now is the back up and rain bike. My second Klein is my 2005 Q-Pro XV. It's the main ride these days and is the beautiful Vulcan Ember color. I still get nice comments reagrding their paint to this day. I'd buy another, but the wife would frown upon adding another bike to the garage! Last year, I saw a long (seemed like 50 pages) Klein technical article explaining every feature Klein has done in great detail. I don't know if you have that somewhere in your info and I may still have it if you want it? Also, being a fellow Mt. Diablo rider, I can relate to this great mountain. Back in the day (when 35 and climbing it twice weekly) I could go OK, although never broke the 1 hour barrier (best was 1:07) and these days, my Klien Q-Pro XV has a triple, so it gets my old and fat bod up to the junction slowly once every week or two. Descending is my strong point these days!! Yesterday, I saw a Garmin rider, follwed by a Garmin team car, hauling tail up South Gate. See or hear anything about it? Looked like he was gonna set a record up it! Hope to talk to you later... Bill

Thanks Bill, I have some old Klein Tech Manuals in PDF form that are about 30 pages but it doesn't sound like what you mention. I would like to have it - I don't really have any way to send people large files though with my e-mail limitations but maybe someday I'll have a file download section on my own webpage... so yeah, if it's not too much trouble and not too big... e-mail it to me. Addy's in my profile. I'll keep my eyes open for an old guy on a Q-Pro XV ;-) No word on a Team Garmin guy on the Mountain... I'll ask around.

Hey Scott, I was in the 'hood in Oct but due to a nasty bike crash in Aug prohibited from riding (plate in shoulder) otherwise I would have joined you an a Diablo ascent. The Quantum is slowly getting bits added on to it, and I have again changed my mind on the colour scheme, opting for all red ano components-it just worked better. Once there is something more substantial to take a pic of it will be on your way. J

Great site. I would love to see fellow bloggers submit their personal Klein photos to compile into a gallery. I haven't heard any news regarding the rumor of Klein's return in 09...probably best for my wallet, though. Keep up the good work!

Hi scott, that's some great reading. I was looking for some info and pictures of the 1990 dolomite Attitude. I have some pictures of the bike on my own blog: www.old-metal.blogspot.com Thanks Bas

Sorry Bas, I only know about Klein *road* bikes. The world is waiting for the Klein MTB fan page though so I nominate YOU.

On the subject of various Klein fanpages - it would also be handy to have a more interactive exchange of information - forum style. I just got the idea because I was stumped when I tried to fit a Mavic 631 SSC square crankset to my '93 Quantum, only to find that it didn't fit i.e. it seems to be a Campagnolo axle. I know Mavic's fit was slightly different but that BB sure isn't ISO.

Great read, its good to see others as passionate about old Kleins as I am. I have a Quantum of about 1992 vintage, it was sitting at my local bike shop a few years ago doing nothing so I made an offer and fulfilled a desire for a Klein that went back to my teens. I'll have a look at my serial and send a photo.

I'm not familiar with Campagnolo equipment...what do you mean by the "!" where you wrote: 2005 Klein Rêve (V for 105, X for Veloce (!), and XX for Dura Ace) Is Veloce good or bad?

Here's a link to the Klein catalogues from 1989 to 1997 ... all the Klein eye candy you could ever want: http://www.mtb-kataloge.de/html/klein.html

your missing a pearl yellow klein quantum pro from the 97 year :) http://velospace.org/node/23969 there is a crap pic of one (mine lol)

Also, the Quantum Race for quite some time (including the possible 97 you have there) have a ether 1" or 1 1/8 steerer instead of the oversized pressed in bearings of the pro model, after trek started doing their thing (and i think after zr9000 frames) it switched to denominate nothing more than part designation. heres a link to alot of the old catalogues if you dont have them already as well http://www.mtb-kataloge.de/html/klein.html

here is the picture of the 97 Quantum pro's bottom bracket/ serial# sorry but its the best i could do on my phone, if its not good enough message me through my email or velospace and i can try and borrow my parents digital camera and try again thanks again for this amazing archive of info!! I can say with 100% certainty that this is the best place for klein road bike info on the web. Especially since trek/klein have removed just about everything that they once provided. max

Thanks for all of the Klein information! I bought my first road bike a 2000 Quantum Pro, full Dura Ace components, with Rolf Vector Pro wheels in excellent condition. It is 59cm and the Sedona Orange color scheme. Since I got it in September, I have put over a 1000 miles on it and I love it! Many people I see while riding tell me how beautiful a bike it is... I feel very fortunate to have it... particularly for the price I paid! I got it for only $500.00! I believe I got a heck of a deal for a great bike!

Hey Scott great stuff!! Just wondering if there is somewhere that I can get info as to what year a bike is based on the serial # (CH0014703) thanks, Paul [email protected] ps. I am up in Sonoma County and try and ride Diablo as much as I can get down there, love that hill!

Hi Paul - I tried to e-mail you but I got a "permanent fail to deliver" message. My e-mail is in my profile. Scott

Pretty sure my Klein Quantum Race is a 1997 or 1998 (S/N: 55 102 98 037P, "Klingon" font, Caribbean green to purple fade). I bought it from a guy around 2000, and can't remember the details of the transaction anymore. I think it's a 53 cm, but I'd like to confirm. What is the correct way to determine the size of a Klein Quantum from the late 1990's? Do I measure from the center of the bottom bracket to the center of the top tube? This measures very close to 53 cm on my bike. Also, I'm curious how to change the handlebar stem, because although I love this bike in many ways, the reach to the handlebars is too much for me. The links on your site regarding how to change the stem are unfortunately no longer valid. My stem is a one-piece, welded "L-shape". It looks like highly polished aluminum. I'll try to get a set of calipers to measure the diameter soon, but it looks pretty small. The nut that holds the stem in place at the top of the steer tube says "Tange" and "Vantage" on it.

@ Reve description: You "... think this was the beginning of the gimmicky stuff Klein started to come out with ...". I recently got one of the last Reve's for my wife. After assembling it with some (meanwhile cheap) triple Campy Record components plus race saddle, I checked the derailleur adjustments. First thought when going over some bumps on the road: I forgot to put sufficient air into the tires - before I remembered the integrated shock absorber (the air pressure was 9 bar, and the 200 gr saddle was harder than I was used to). Thus, the absorber isn't a gimmick! It is a typical and consequent KLEIN innovation making biking more efficient. While other manufactures are just trying to safe weight (e. g. by using carbon = plastic frames + light uncomfortable wheels), Gary Klein makes riding less fatigue by avoiding shock/vibration stress to the riders body (in particular the back). The only alternative to achieve this without adding weight (the absorber does not weight much more than the equivalent piece of alu) is to put only 2-3 bars into a 23 mm tire instead of 9. Klein chose BASF, a worldwide leading company, as the supplier of these absorbers. BASF is also supplier for the automotive industry: the same material is used under another brand name for shock absorbers assembled betweeen the car suspension and the car chassis. Going back from the Reve (even only after some miles) to a normal carbon/alu bike is like from a modern 300 hp-Mercedes to a Porsche of the 80's. Nice to drive the Porsche for some miles but happy to have the Mercedes (or whatever fast, comforable car else) for your long distance drives. Except, you drive on a recently paved highway. Some reviewers (in Germany) said, the fork of the Reve is too heavy. But, this is not true. It is designed for the stability you need when use the application range the bike has (bad, even unpaved roads/also with luggage). It is a pity that Klein does no more exist and that this innovation cannot be developed further (e. g. by adding a small absorber ring before assembling the fork to the frame). Klaus - Germany 1991 Klein Quantum (purple) - biking on small Alpine and italian roads.

I have a Klein Quantum II. I love the bike so have upgraded to a threadless headset and fork. This has made a huge difference for me as I have far more control over the bike. I am considering upgrading my componentry as well to SRAM Force. [email protected]

I have a Klein Stage Comp that I bought in the mid to late 90's. It was the first realy high quality bike tha I purchased. Started out with a Dawes as kid in the 70's and then in the mid 80's bought a Bridgestone that was a 450 series I believe. Yor web site is the best I've found for information on the Klein bikes. I am currently having mine overhauled. I still ride it. It's abeautiful bike in mint condition. Olin - Texas

great entry! it's a shame the era of Klein is finished. my friends used to tease me about the 'flexible aluminum' frame on my quantum II. unfortunately, i just wrecked it last week and broke the original forks. hope to get it back next week with some new hardware. i'll send before and after pics if you are interested, I think i have a fairly unusual setup.

Great entry! I referred some geometry information from here. Thanks a lot. FYI, Trek in Japan is not selling Klein in 2010. (Some stock may be available, but no more new models.) So it seems completely over in 2009 though I still think it's already ended around 1996-1998. Only few eccentric company like Storck possibly compete.

I have really enjoyed your blog and keep up the good work! I found a 2002 Quantum Race with a bent handlebar and bent front wheel at AS-Is Liquidators for $700. It has a deep blue paint job that has held up very well and keeps getting compliments. I am working on a 2001 Quantum Race frame with a silver cloud finish and it will have all 105 and ultegra parts. I use Mavic 32-spoke wheels 'cause I'm on the heavy side and I absolutely love riding the Klein!

Thanks for writing Scott - and everyone else. Love the stories.

thank you very much for this, very informative. btw, do you have any info about quantum Z model? i got one from market with shimano 600 but no idea about the histoey. best best, pirak

Regarding the demise of the Klein brand, the story I heard is that it was all quite amicable. Gary didn't want to do it anymore and Trek didn't see any point to keeping it going.

Just found a place in CA. Leucadia Cyclery. They still has some Kleins AVAILABLE. I'm not sure how many are left now, as of April 7, 2011, but Fred still has some bikes and frames. Good Luck! Maybe they'll have what you want!

Cool, I'm buying a Klein Quantum II second hand tomorrow, was doing some research to see what was getting into and didn't realise how rich the history of these bikes are.

Thanks for the site. I can help I.D. the 2000-2001 Quantums because I own a 2000 Quantum Race and read over everything when I was buying. Unless you paid for a custom job, the 2000 Quantum Race was "Silver Cloud" (gorgeous white and sliver) and the Quantum Pro "Plum Crazy" (iridescent purple that changed colors). The biggest differences between the two were Ultegra on the Quantum Race with a icon carbon fork, the Quantum Pro got Dura-Ace with an Aeros fork. This is in the post-sale Trek era, and both came sprinkled with cheaper Bontrager parts and wheels. If you have a Quantum Pro in Silver Cloud, then you have the 2001 model. Klein moved the Silver Cloud paint from the "Race" to the "Pro" model for 2001.

Ever heard of a Klein 'Navigator'? http://cgi.ebay.com/220839803216

Hi, based on what I've managed to find, including here, I think I have (one of?) the earliest Klein frame(s) out there... Just visit retrobike.co.uk then type "Quite very early Klein frame" and enjoy! Yes, original owner!

Hi, I have a 2006 Klein Q Pro XX and was wondering should it have a small indentation and then a very lightly flattened area on the downtube near where the FD clamp would sit? The flattened are extended down towards the bottom bracket. any jhelp would be appreciated.

@Graeme - I haven't seen that, but if you're thinking it might be damaged it doesn't sound very likely. Damage would probably be a dent or a crease. Flattened spots sound more like it was manufactured that way for whatever reason - mounting the derailleur, mating up with the BB, whatever. Send me a photo!

Hi, I have a Quantum frame that's a kind of purple/blue/copper (Purple Haze?). I don't know the year. I t might be a 2000. On the BB there are a few #'s. On the drive side there's T BI-1342, on the none-drive side this: 55I 0300 is above this: WTUI28164R. Any idea which is the serial#, and what if any info is contained in these #'s? Can you tell the year? Thanks for your time. Steve

BTW, In regards to my above post, the frame looks almost, if not identical to that flat-bar road bike the Quantum TT on your blog.

I,ve bought a brand new Klein Quantum pro [wthout a fork] For only 150 euro,s. I,v put a cinelli track fork in it because it had the same rake [35 mm] and drilled a conversionkit for it. When it is finished I will post some foto's Chris from the Netherlands

Dankjewel Chris. Aangenaam.

Hello Scott, great site! I just lucked into a Klein Quantum and was wanting to know a bit more about it. According to the style of letering it looks to be pre 1992 but here's the serial number: 3QE000364 prececed by a circled K It's equipped with a complete Shimano 105(1055)groupset. Anything you can come up with would be appreciated:) Robert

Robert - you need to e-mail me if you want a response, and a photo or at least the color of your Quantum would help, but my best guess is yes... 1986 - 1991. Serial numbers in that era aren't a lot of help. Check out the "I love my klein" facebook page, maybe someone there will recognize it.

Scott, I have 2 Klein's. One is a black (63cm/I think) Quantum I think I bought in late 1989. It has the solid "KLEIN" name on it. It has Shimano gears, etc. that say "600." I will have to check for the serial #. I paid, including shoes, pedals, computer, etc. around $2,000-$2400. I also have a red Klein that I think is a Kirsten, but it has no name on it other than Klein. It is small, and my wife rides it. I bought it in early 1990, but it had been in the shop a long time (paid just $750). I can take a photo of mine tonight, but my wife's is in the shop getting a tune up. I assume both bikes are 1989 models, but I don't know. Any help identifying the bikes would be appreciated. I bought them both at Loco Motion in Winter Park, Florida. Thanks, John Smith ([email protected])

I read a 1982 Bicycling! article by Bev Bogle, and another by Gary Klein. They sparked my ambition to finally build a custom bike. I designed the frame, and Perley's welding (a true artist) did thee welding. Gary did the normalizing. Still have that bike and it is a true piece of art. Aside from the geometry it is hauntingly similar to a Team Superlight Road.

If you want a photo I'm at [email protected]

Hi Scott, I'm in the process of building up an Aura XV with mostly campag parts, and mostly in silver, as it suits the iridescent Blue/Purple tones and silver (base metal) logo. I'm having trouble with the headset specs as they seem a bit unusual. The Klein spec sheet says Cane Creek Internal 25.4/34.0/30.0, 8mm stack. Any advice on what would fit would be well received. The frame's being built up by Melbourne's finest - Dan at Shifter Bikes. The frame's already been posted on Shifters Instagram site due to the amazing paint job! Thanks, Stuart

@Stuart Gordon: Sorry I have no idea. I'll bet the folks at Cane Creek would be able to tell you though - send them an e-mail.

I am the proud owner of 4 road Kleins, all font 1 bikes. The one I purchased recently on Ebay is a Quantum, all Dura Ace with the old 6 speed downtube SIS shifters that has the cable disappear in the down tube and the rear derailier cable is inserted into the cable stay. I've never seen another Klein road bike like it.

@feetdry: Check out the 1985 Team Super on my Photos and SN page: https://picasaweb.google.com/108112939684385339347/KleinRoadBikeSerialNumbers?noredirect=1#5593994115598599490 4 or 5 shots there showing the unusual cable routing.

Yes, I didn't proof my comment. I meant to say that the derailier cable is inserted into the CHAIN stay. Your photo #88 of 97 & 92 of 97 and 93 of 97 all look like the routing of my Klein. The brake cable retains the normal routing along the top of the top tube. Also the Quantum is a slanted blue font with white trim.

Klein people are responding. I need to take pictures and send in s/n of my now 5, font1 Kleins.

Hello- I have a 55cm stage comp fro the late 90s that is a bit too long for me. Someone recommended to replace the quill with one that has a shorter horizontal extension. Two bike shops turned me away with a "do not carry." (that in bike-crazy Portland!) Any suggestions?

Far as I know a quill is a quill, just make sure you get the right clamp diameter for your bars. Seriously, any decent bike shop should at least be able to help you out, even if they don't have one in stock. You could also do a threadless conversion post. Here - pick one. http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=quill+stem

I just got my purple 1988 Quantum out of the shop. All the Shimano 600 has be removed and replaced with a new Dura Ace external DI2 groupo. In addition, it's sporting Dura Ace C24 wheels. Oh, not to mention the new Phil Wood BB to allow for the new Dura Ace axel. Had to mill 3mm off the inside of each drop out to make room for the 11 speed cassette. Just took her for a spin yesterday and it's a sweet Klein. Wish Gary could see her.

Trying to figure out a year on the Klein Quantum I stumbled across, S/N: KQU1E1 on the bottom of the left seat stay. It's a glossy jet black and since it was relatively light/super stiff I bought a slammed quill stem and was looking to throw on full ultegra 6800 to replace the old dura ace 7700 drivetrain and turn it into a crit bike... Had thought it was early 2000's but doesn't resemble the pictures... Any insight would be awesome!

Wiley - the last of those "under the seat stay" serial numbers was either 1991 or 1992. 1990 Quantum definitely came in a glossy black. Lots of those early 90's Kleins were sold as bare frames so you might've had any group set on it originally, including Campy. https://plus.google.com/photos/108112939684385339347/albums/5254851376969004353/5593993447696743698?banner=pwa&pid=5593993447696743698&oid=108112939684385339347

Scott, I rode a blue Klein Quantum in the 1988 RAGBRAI, maybe the one you saw. A few people thought it was a beautiful bike and I told them it was a great ride. Had a motorcycle accident the next year and have not rode it much since then. My son-in-law was the last to race it in a tri.

Great story John, although I remember talking to the owner ... oh let's just say it WAS you... makes for an even better story and who's going to say otherwise?

1990? Ha I'm the same age as my frame. Knee issues/crashes this year, hopefully will pull a few wins on it in it's 25th year! Side note I did go through and throw ultegra 6800 on it, along with a flo 30 wheelset it has been just about the perfect crit bike. Some extreme tire rub on one of the seat stays is causing me a little worry so it may need to be retired next year, but it is a beauty and will be hung on the wall when she's no longer rideable.

Hi all, I have purchased a Klein quantum pro frame (supposely after Klein was puchased by Trek but before moving the production). The color is purple and it has the carbon aero fork. The SN is 8(or 9)X11970599(or 8)... Any idea which years model is it. And does it worth to try to restore with the original parts. Best regards Evangelos from Denmark

Evangelos! Sounds like a 1999 from the serial number, but purple wasn't the stock color that year so probably a custom order. Google for photos of 99 Quantum Pro and see what you think. Original parts not so important, modern Dura Ace would go well on it.

Thank Diablo, Did I say purple :) sorry I meant green ... I am planning to put SRAM red on (I Like Sram) - if I modernized it. But it is a fantastic frame. To the point that I am considering getting another one. May I ask how you determined the year from the SN. Best regards Evangelos

>May I ask how you determined the year from the SN. I haven't figured out all the serial number schemes, but I sort of know when they changed from one scheme to another scheme. I have other serial numbers in my files for people who know their bike's model year. The 1998 Quantum Pro's (like mine) have serial numbers like this: 55X0198037P The 55 is the size, and the 98 is the year. The 1999 Quantum Pro's have serial numbers like this: 7X019TUI09022R I don't know what any of those figures mean.

Hi again, You are a great source of information. Looking the klein catalogure from 99 (http://www.vintage-trek.com/Trek-Fisher-Klein-Lemond/1999klein.pdf) I can see a MTB with a similar green metalic color. The pic is of a low resolution and I can't see if it also has the purple nuances. But thanks alot I knoe now it from the pre TREK factory. I have found some parts for replacing the cable routing and also some stem/headset part. Thanks alot for the help. If you want I can email you pics of the frame + SN for your archives. Best regards Evangelos

Yeah thanks. Send them to [email protected] See this page for inspiration. https://photos.google.com/album/AF1QipM4pNYAZr9WMCIo6l2erhZ0aPv0WE8JjQIcnS8 Also, did you see the photo I took of the Copenhagen train station? http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/5269/171/1600/Copenhagen-Train-Station-2000.jpg

Hey! Cheers from Germany! Your website showed the only Mid `90 Quantum Pro in Caribbean Linear Fade, I could find! I just bought one from California and am happy to have it sent over to Germany. Very informative site. I`ll put you in my bookmarks! Currently, I own: * 1994 KLEIN Quantum Pro, MC2 (Coral Reef, 57 cm) * 1995 KLEIN Quantum Pro, MC2.1 (Coral Reef, 61 cm) * 1995 KLEIN Quantum Pro, MC2 (Caribbean linear fade 61 cm) * 1995 KLEIN Quantum Race (Caribbean Linear Fade, 57 cm) Cheers Falko

After my latest purchase of a TS I am going to stop collecting Gary's early Klein road bikes. Here is my early road bike list: 1-Custom (probably a Stage Tour) of about 1981 with an accompanying photo of Gary and the new owner standing behind it. It is Silver and has Gary's signature on the top tube. 1- 1986 Red Quantum in all 7400 Dura Ace 1-1986 Stage Tour, powder blue, outfitted with current Sram Red eTAP 1-1986 purple Kirsten all 600 Tricolor 1-1987 purple, Quantum outfitted with all Dura Ace and Di2 1-1987 Quantum, Red, Ritchey carbon front fork, all Ultegra components 1-1986 Chehalis Klein plant mgr personal build, Quantum, Green/blue fade. 1-1989 Team Super, all 600 Tricolor, Aurora 1-1991 Panache, Silver, all Campy 1-1991 Performance, Teal, all Ultegra, This Klein I purchased new in 1991. That's it except I do have 2 early Klein mtn. bikes. So that is my Klein collection Terry Purdy

Hey, first what a great resource. Second, I have a 21" 1992 Horizon Linear Fade Attitude with factory-fit RockShox Mag20s, Mission Control 2, Pressfit 1 3/8 headset and press fit bottom bracket, rear facing drop outs and the original 27.1mm seatpost. Its serial is (K) ATT0002090. I'd love to hear if anyone has any info on it or anything. I bough the frames second hand - but never ridden in 1994. I've built it up, but it's basically fitted with 90s kit. It has the Klein 1A logo with the outline. So, any news regarding it mutely appreciated. It's a beauty and I love it. ha ha

I just got a Klein to use as my commuter bike. Its got a painted grey frame with a chromed steel fork and logo 1 on the frame. it's built with 7 speed campagnolo and has internal cable routing. It has non aero brake cables and single pivot brakes. If anyone has any info about this bike I would appreciate knowing more about it.

I have a 1997 Quantum Race that I used fairly heavily the last two years that I raced seriously. It is fitted with Dura Ace components. FWIW, I also have a 2000 Klein Attitude Comp that I picked up while still able to get a discount. I pretty much quit riding after I quit racing for various reasons. I am thinking about riding again. What are your thoughts about having the old kit overhauled or getting newer components? If newer, what are your recommendations. I should note that there are battle scars on the equipment from the occasional crash. I was really pleased when I found this and other similar sites and posts. When I raced, I rode several different frames depending on the which manufacturer was sponsoring us that year. The Klein was by far my favorite.

I thought you might like some photos of what I think is a 1981-1983 catalog. I was a a Klein dealer from 1995 until Trek stopped making them. Let me know where to send them.

Yes thanks Jerry - but you didn't leave me YOUR e-mail. Mine's in my bio at the top of the page: [email protected] Also, I have a neat file someone sent me with scans of 1983 catalogue including a letter from Gary Klein. The kind of thing you would get if you sent Klein a letter asking for information. You'd like to see that so get back to me!

Hey! I'm the guy that won the 2003 contest! I'd been considering buying an older used Quantum frame (couldn't possibly afford a new one at the time) when I found their paint a Klein contest online. I'm just now retiring it because I'm concerned about corrosion around the bottom bracket and fork dropouts. Unfortunately only half of those years were ridden in Socal weather. Can't complain at all since I did manage to get about 60,000 miles and 3 million feet of climbing out of it. I can confirm that all the accolades are true. Light, fast, stable, and comfortable. Trek also did a beautiful job painting my design (they named it "bones", I called it x-ray since it glows in the dark) and I still get compliments. Anyway, it's so great to find others with an appreciation of these wonderful machines. Thanks for creating this blog, Scott!

COOL! I remember that glow-in-the-dark bones paintjob... wasn't my style but it was definitely unique. Thanks for writing. I'm still riding my 1998 Quantum Pro, but only in good weather. Be sure to check out my main blog page with regular ride reports. http://diabloscott.blogspot.com/

I have owned 4 Kleins before I stopped riding and racing in 2014 due to a 2nd clot in my leg. I owned an original 2 yr which I broke at Mt Hamilton Century with a cracked seat tube binder, they were ultra thin at the time. The boron fibers were added to seat stays inner sides and chainstays and inner sides of fork blades only. Boron fiber is razer sharp and very hard to work with, it was set in a Bondo type resin. That frame was replaced under warranty with a Quantum Race and I broke this frame at the bottom bracket at seat tube joint while racing, this frame was replaced under warranty as well just before Gary moved from Ca, for a dark green metallic 1998 Quantum Pro which I still have. I later purchased a Q Pro V, which I still have, from a shop in Colorado, by mail, and I replaced all the components immediately with Campy Record components. Trek killed off Klein as they in the final iterations they had replaced the frame material with OCLV carbon and where marketing only in Japan, there was an online catalog for Japan showing this at the time and I felt the frames competed with Trek's carbon crap of the time and Trek removed it from their line and killed off Botranger as well. I owned a 1st-year OCLV which creaked so bad at the BB it sounded like it was breaking. I have never seen a full Carbon Klein in person and I did not make a screenprint copy of the Japanese Klein catalog as that would be a real rarity. Storck also competed although their availability in the US was nill to none. I remember talking with Storck at Interbike in Anaheim as he was trying to find distributors and shops to sell in the US but that did not happen at the time. I really wanted to own a Fascenario or Crumpton as my last bike but the 2 DVT's ended that.

My email is [email protected]. I’m curious to know if ALL of the 2002 Quantum Race frame’s were made in Chehalis WA prior to the final move-out to WI. Also, was the Night Storm paint option available at all after ‘02? Is there somewhere I can look up a serial number for confirmation on the frame’s manufacturing plant location? Thanks very kindly

Just picked up a Klein Q Carbon frame From my a local bike shop as a replacement for a dead Bianchi XL EV2. Had the shop swap my Campy Record components over as part of the process. I'm exceptionally happy with the frame. The bike climbs and accelerates like a dream, and feels very secure in corners. I will say, compared to the Bianchi, it feels like the carbon stays do make a difference

I'm picking a Klein bike up tomorrow! Reading this thread has me so excited!

Just bought a rust-red Klein Performance (or at least I think it's a Performance) with serial number C48F. It is old enough to have Type 1 font and the original 816 Power Tubing decal. It has three water bottle bosses, rack and fender eyelets. It has the smaller diameter (~1.6") down and top tube of the older Kleins and the original style of fork, although that is chromed. Love to hear any thoughts as to vintage.

You guys need to give me an email if you want a response. C48F doesn't match the format of any Performance in my database. The oldest one I see is 1989 and has number S652. So send me a photo.

I just updated my profile to show email, but just in case I'm [email protected]. How can we send you pix of bikes? Thanks, Peter

In the mid eighties I asked Gary to build me a custom touring bike. The serial number was P12C - easy to remember as it was (loosely) based on the Performance geometry, and it was only the 12th custom bike he had made thus far based on this configuration. I asked him for all the cables to be fully internal - including dynamo wiring! - which Gary happily obliged. He even agreed to install custom eyelets for my in-house built racks - and also cantilever bosses. This was quite unusual for a road bike from Klein. The most interesting feature/story is about the color. I requested a specific pink/fuchsia color, but applied in a specific manner. I still can’t believe to this day that he actually agreed to do it! I requested a silver-white primer, then the paint, then a few coats of clear gloss with metallic sparkles in the gloss (not in the paint). The whole becomes an eerily luminous color. Just a few weeks later Gary contacted me and said that it was the most beautiful color to come out of the shop, and asked if it was okay to use it for future bikes. Maybe he was just polite, but coincidentally the next year we started to see the gorgeous paint jobs that became synonymous with Klein. I spent a few decades in the bike industry (I started a bike pannier company at the same era). Last time I saw Gary it must have been around 2002. He was toying with the idea of creating a fully suspended touring bike - which included suspending racks, panniers and gear. He asked me if I’d be interested in creating the panniers. Sadly, but understandably, it never happened. In 2005 my custom Klein was stolen when my son left the garage door open. To this day it has been the most satisfying bike I ever owned. Serge Vigeant

Sounds like an Awesome Paint Job... I had (3) different colors of PowderCoated MountainBike Frames with similar 'characteristics'; one MountainCycle ShockWave Pearlescent White (base) with SilverSlivers in the Topcoat that looks like Fresh Powder(Snow) on a SUNNY Day, two SanAndreas in NeonBlazeOrange with GoldSlivers Topcoat, and one Yeti as-X in PearlescentYellow with GoldSlivers TopCoat... they are beautiful indoors, but incredibly *VIBRANT* and *Shimmeringly ALIVE* in Sunlight...!!! I would like to do something similar to my '96 Klein QuantumII Teal/Cobalt 10s RetroMod, yet I do not dislike the original paint enough to go through the Effort nor ruin the original paint, plus I color-matched with Mavic COSMIC BlueAno Wheelset (Hubs/Rims/Tires), CNC BlueAno BrakeCalipers, Teal CNC Anodized LiteNing Cranks and TealAno FlexStem and StraightBars... my KLEIN Mantra and Adept will also retain original paint, although are obviously 'used' while being courageously 'improved' and 'updated'... TYVM for your wonderful blog with interesting KLEIN information and details and observations...

We need a way to post pics even if we have to host and I would like to see nofretbret's discussed paint schemes...

Product Review: Carbon wheelset by YoeleoBike. Boy these things are crap - expensive, heavy, slow, and ugly. Also, their marketing group is an intellectual midget with BO. #yoeleobike wheels suck! https://www.yoeleobike.com/collections/cyclocross-wheelset

@Diablo Scott : dude like you I felt Yoeleo's spam was a bit annoying - nice response from your side 😂😂😂 BTW I still haven't finished that teal Quantum 🙈 eventually the colour scheme became white and red everything. Subsequently the process of finding suitable red ano etc parts. Now about to do my own anodising of a Campa STI set (only because it can be fully disassembled and rebuilt. Still looking for a red ano front derailleur that works on a 53 front but likely will do this

btw The Japan website is no longer: Info on Lemond and Klein split. Trek dropped Klein because it was a direct competitor to the Madrone and they could have that. https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=58772 Looks like 2009 was the last year for US Kleins....

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Vintage Trek Catalogs

Table of Contents

Here you can find all the Trek catalogs from 1976 up to 1999. If you’re looking for a specific model for a specific year, you can find them further in the article.

Trek Catalogs

• Trek Catalog 1976
• Trek Catalog 1977
• Trek Catalog 1978
• Trek Catalog 1979
• Trek Catalog 1980
• Trek Catalog 1981
• Trek Catalog 1982
• Trek Catalog 1983-1
• Trek Catalog 1983-2
• Trek Catalog 1984
• Trek Catalog 1985All-Terrain
• Trek Catalog 1985Trek2000
• Trek Catalog 1985TrekRacing
• Trek Catalog 1985TrekSport
• Trek Catalog 1985TrekTouring
• Trek Catalog 1986
• Trek Catalog 1987
• Trek Catalog 1988
• Trek Catalog 1989
• Trek Catalog 1990
• Trek Catalog 1991
• Trek Catalog 1992
• Trek Catalog 1993
• Trek Catalog 1994
• Trek Catalog 1995
• Trek Catalog 1996
• Trek Catalog 1997
• Trek Catalog 1998
• Trek Catalog 1999

History and Iconic Models

Trek started out in 1975 by providing only frames. In 1976 they would supply entire bicycles.

For many people Trek is most famous for sponsoring Lance Armstrong’s U.S. Postal team during the late 90’s up to his retirement.

But Trek already pioneered the use of carbon fiber in 1989 with the Trek 5000.

It would result in the short-lived but daring design of the Y-Foil, introduced in 1998. One of the few bikes that is designated with something more than just a number.

They were also early adopters of the mountain bike craze, with the Trek 850 launched in 1983.

Their early foray in using carbon fiber would be later used with the introduction of the iconic Y33 and Y22 models. Mountain bikes with a monocoque carbon fiber frame. Although it used the suspension technique URT ( unified rear triangle ) which would turn out to be rubbish, the original design was considered iconic.

If you’re interested in learning more about vintage Trek bicycles, please visit vintage-trek.com .

Trek Models

Mountain bike, you might also like.

Vintage GT Catalogs

Here you can find a selection of GT catalogs from 1990 up to 1998. If you’re looking for a specific model for a specific year,

Vintage Kona Catalogs

Here you can find all the Kona catalogs from 1989 up to 1999. If you’re looking for a specific model for a specific year, you can

Vintage Giant Catalogs

Unfortunately I was only able to find a couple of Giant catalogs. Although it’s a huge bicycle brand, finding the Giant catalogs proved to be

Vintage Cannondale Catalogs

Here you can find all the Cannondale catalogs from 1983 up to 1999.  If you’re looking for a specific model for a specific year, you

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PreTrek Kleins

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What was the year that Trek bought klein? Did Trek take over manufacturing Kleins bikes also? The reason I ask is I saw this statement in a auction description. THIS FRAME WAS MANUFACTURED IN CHEHALIS WASHINGTON :USING GARY KLEINS TUBING, IN GARY KLEINS FACTORY, USING GARY KLEINS WELDERS THAT HAD WORKED FOR HIM FOR YEARS. THE FACT THAT TREK MAY HAVE OWNED KLEIN AT THE TIME IS IRRELEVANT! THE FRAME IS STILL PRE TREK MANUFACTURING NOT MADE IN WISCONSIN AND THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT THIS FRAME WILL BE COLLECTABLE SOME DAY!!!  

a coke can top tube klein will never become a classic...  

jcrew94123 said: Ask a different person....get a different answer. Technically, Trek acquired Klein in 1995 and production moved to Wisconsin in 2002. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_Bikes Click to expand...

The 96 models were the last of the Klein Kleins. There were minor changes that Trek made, i.e. choice of stem color (or so I hear) but even though Trek may have owned Klein in 96, they made no changes. In 97, they made definitive changes. Jcrew says ask a different person but there really isn't much debate about the substance of 96 being the last of the "pre-trek" or "real" Kleins. Some people, including those who are very qualified to know say that the post-trek Kleins were still excellent bikes but that isn't the issue. The issue to a collector is that it is still the old school Klein, so up to and including 1996 models.  

If Klein was owned by Trek in 1995, then any Klein bike made or sold after that is, by definition, a "post-Trek Klein". I'm aware that people choose to think otherwise but since the company was sold/acquired in 1995, there really isn't much room for debate.  

Thanks for the info:thumbsup:  

If anybody has an opinion on what is a real preTrek Klein, I want to hear it. After Trek bought Klein, did Trek reduce the amount of exotic paint jobs that seperated Klein from the average fat tube aluminum bike?  

Have a look at this.... http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=87601&highlight=  

As I told before, I count -96 still pre-trek era Kleins. As there was no major changes on frames. -97 and later are still great frames and many says they are best for riding as they have suspension geometry.  

For me the demarcation point is when they switched to the "Star Trek-style" font for their "Klein" decals, which started to show up in 95/96.  

jcrew94123 said: If Klein was owned by Trek in 1995...there really isn't much room for debate. Click to expand...

In 1996, you couldn't get the MC2 or a Judy suspension fork painted to match the frame. Klein was already limiting their color choices as of '96. In '96 the Adroit came in both 2" and 1.75" downtube versions. There isn't much to distinguish a '96 Adroit (1.75") with Judy vs. a '97 Adroit with Judy. The reason that there isn't a pressed in BB in '97 is because Shimano's new gruppos required the Octalink bottom bracket. Again if you go back to his question, "what is a pre-Trek Klein" then the answer HAS to be what year was Klein an independent company and that would be some part of 1995. If the question was "what year did Klein bikes stop including certain desirable frame details?" well that is a totally different question.  

jcrew94123 said: The reason that there isn't a pressed in BB in '97 is because Shimano's new gruppos required the Octalink bottom bracket. Click to expand...

Not sure what you mean by '99/'00. I have a '97 Adroit that's completely original with M950 XTR and bottom bracket.  

Ugh Octalink available for XTR in 1995/1996. Octalink wasn't available below XTR until 1999-2000 If Klein was truely catering to Shimano's new design then the threaded BB shell would have been available earlier. Also why bother changing BB shells since the majority of their bikes shipped with square taper BB's anyway?  

jcrew94123 said: In 1996, you couldn't get the MC2 or a Judy suspension fork painted to match the frame. Klein was already limiting their color choices as of '96. Click to expand...

jcrew94123 said: In '96 the Adroit came in both 2" and 1.75" downtube versions. There isn't much to distinguish a '96 Adroit (1.75") with Judy vs. a '97 Adroit with Judy. Click to expand...

jcrew94123 said: Again if you go back to his question, "what is a pre-Trek Klein" then the answer HAS to be what year was Klein an independent company.. Click to expand...

Should have stuck with my original answer..."ask a different person..."  

the threaded bottom bracket was the end.  

jcrew94123 said: Should have stuck with my original answer..."ask a different person..." Click to expand...

I'm not sour, not at all. If anything, I'm just curious why folks choose to argue with the calendar. I didn't decide when Trek bought out Klein and neither did Pinguin. By definition, a Pre-Trek Klein is a Klein bike that was made before Trek acquired them so look to Wiki, or the SEC to confirm when the buyout was complete. I have Kleins on both side of the buyout and I'm happy with all of them. EDIT: if you believe Wiki is filled with mis-information on when Klein was acquired, feel free to submit your changes to them along with the substantiating evidence that backs up your info.  

herbn said: the threaded bottom bracket was the end. Click to expand...

Is my Klein pre-trek? Is my Homegrown Yeti built? Cooks cranks or cook brothers racing cranks? Truly questions for the ages.  

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Cannondale Rush ~ Lefty Sport Handmade in USA-Magura Julie /Sram Hydraulic Disc

Gary Fisher Prometheus Titanium High-Tech HI Performance Racer Shimano XTR M900

Cannondale F1000 Cad3 Design-Lightning White, ridden 5 times - Handmade in USA

Cannondale F900 SL- Bogus Mountain topographic map Frame-HeadShok Fatty Ultra SI

Klein Fervor Candy Red Shimano STX Special Edition

Klein MC1 Attitude Fuselage Backfire Unicrown Fork, Mission Control Handlebars

Vintage Klein Attitude Team Storck NOS, 1992 Time Capsule New not repainted USA

1992 MC1 Klein Attitude -Mission Control – Klein Box Crown Fork-New Death-Grips

Klein Pinnacle Dolomite MC1 Magenta, Green, White MC1 Showroom Fresh build USA

Klein Rascal Fuselage Sunburst Linear Fade- MC1 Handlebars/Stem Rigid fork MINT

Klein Stratum 185 Carbon Fiber Handlebar

Fisher Montare, Gloss Black Shimano Deore DX Groupo US Retro Classic -Large 20”

Klein Adept Pro Plum Crazy Purple Chameleon, Rebuilt Manitou Black Fork Fox Shox

Vintage Klein Attitude Fuselage MC1 Mission Control- Rigid Unicrown Fork

2002 LeMond Bicycles Zurich Base

Stack and reach vs. category trend.

The Bike Insights Upright/Aggressive scale is based on analysis of a bike’s proportions relative to similar sized bikes in the same category.

Table 2 - TUBING TENSILE STRENGTH AND YIELD STRENGTH*

* Most of the information in Tables 1 and 2 was extracted from Jalon Hawk's DesperadoCycles.com web site. Included at his site is Jalon's excellent write up of the geometry and physical properties of the various tubings and what it all means.

** Tubeset weight is not consistent among tubing manufacturers. The length of some of the tubes in a set is different between makers as is the length of butted sections. As a result, the total tubeset weights are not indicative of the relative weight of the resulting bike.

HELICOMATIC HUBS

Trek used Maillard Helicomatic rear hubs on some road bike Models in the mid 80s. They were a clever French innovation using a special cassette (of cogs) that mounts onto a special hub. Great idea, but poorly engineered and tested; they proved to be unreliable. For more information, see Sheldon Brown's comments at http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_ha-i.html#helicomatic and at The Yellow Jersey http://www.yellowjersey.org/helico.html .

What to do if you have one on your Trek and it no longer works, or you want a more reliable setup? People often replace the Helicomatic hub/wheel with a freewheel wheel or freehub wheel. If they are concerned about originality, they keep their original wheel and work to find a replacement for the hub or cassette. They show up occasionally on Ebay.com.

Vintage Trek bikes were originally painted with DuPont Imron paint. Imron is a two part paint that is difficult to use by other than professional painters. Imron is still available from DuPont. Some frame painters still use it today. However, some localities have clean air regulations that prohibit its use.

Classic Rendezvous provides a list of expert bike frame painters and refinishers. Desperado Cycles uses Imron as do Joe Bell Bicycle Refinishing , Rad Finishes and Spectrum Cycles . If you know of other painters who do, please let me know .

Many of the Imron colors used by Trek are still available. Trek generally used the same Imron color name as did DuPont, so it often is possible to match the original color. The Joe Bell Bicycle Refinishing web site has a PDF copy of the Imron color chart on its site.

For many years, Trek had a service to repaint an old Trek for an owner or bike shop. It would not reproduce the original colors and graphics, but used the then current year graphics and colors. This way, a bike might have been made in one year but have paint and graphics from a later year. The repaint service was discontinued around 2010.

TREK DECALS

One source of reproduction Trek decals is VeloCals.com . Here are examples of reproduction Trek graphics made by VeloCals . You can contact JR Anderson of VeloCals at [email protected] .

PAINT TOUCH UP

Because the paint used on Vintage Treks, Imron, is a two-part paint, it is difficult to use for touchup. Many serious bike collectors use Testor's paint. It comes in little bottles and spray cans. It is used for car and airplane models and can be found at hobby shops in lots of colors. If you can't find a match, mix a couple of colors together.

Richard Kaufman writes: "Testor's "Model Master" Enamel Paint in FRENCH BLUE is a virtual match for the Dupont Imron "Race Blue" on my '85 Trek 600. No mixing with other colors required, in my opinion."

Car paint touch up paint also works fine. Get it at a car parts store or car dealer. The bottle comes with its own paintbrush. Color matching can take a bit of work, you may need to mix two or more bottles.

Others have had good luck with fingernail polish, red bikes are especially good for this but, depending on the latest fashion, other colors work as well.

Another option is take the bike to a specialty shop that sells auto paints (not just an auto body shop). They will scan the paint on the bike and mix a perfect match. They can give you the paint in a jar or can put it in a spray bottle. It is a bit pricey; on the order of $60.

THREADING THE DERAILLEUR CABLE THROUGH THE CHAINSTAY

Trek ran the rear derailleur cable through the right chainstay for most of their steel road bikes beginning in 1985 and ending in 1989. A clever idea - that has its supporters and detractors. However, cleverness is also required when replacing the cable. Rich Tong's "Tong Family Blog" lists some helpful methods.

INTERNAL RUSTPROOFING OF A FRAME

Unlike some other frame materials, a steel frame does not degrade through normal use or simply through age. However, if a steel bike is ridden in the rain or is kept outdoors, rust on the inside surfaces of the frame tubing can be a problem. A way to check if your frame has been damaged by rust is to remove the bottom bracket and look at the bottom bracket shell and the tubes. Some rust is normal, but lots of rust or significant pitting can be a problem.

To prevent, or significantly reduce, internal rusting, people spray the inside of the tubes with a rust preventative. Two excellent products are "Frame Saver" by J. Peter Weigle and "Boeshield T-9" developed by Boeing. Frame Saver dries to a wax-like coating. It is available at most pro bike shops and over the web. Boeshield T-9 is a protectant and lubricant; it stays oily. Which to use? Peter Weigle is a custom frame maker (support a fellow bike guy). Boeing makes lots of great things that fly, but I believe bikes are not included . . .

People also use LPS 3, a heavy-duty rust inhibitor, which leaves a transparent waxy film. It is commonly available at hardware stores in spray cans.

A simple solution is to spray the insides with WD-40 penetrating oil. It dries to a thin, varnish-like coating that protects the metal. Not quite as good as the three products above, but much better than nothing at all. (BTW - because of this drying characteristic, WD-40 should not be used as a long-term lubricant.)

The rustproofing products above generally do not require removing the rust inside the frame tubes before applying. However, cleaning the inside of the bottom bracket and the headtube of loose rust is a good idea. To treat, remove the bottom bracket, headset and seat post. Spray into every opening in the frame, including the vent holes in the stays. Then, I like to tape over the openings and rotate the frame slowly a few times in various directions, to be sure that all internal surfaces are soaked. Remove the tape and let the excess run out. For the waxy coating types, and WD-40, it it best to allow a day or two drying time before reassembling.

CONVERTING FROM A QUILL STEM TO A MODERN THREADLESS STEM

Your vintage bike came with a quill stem. Can it be converted to a more modern threadless stem? NO, YES, and YES.

NO - The steerer tube on the original fork is almost certainly not long enough to use a full threadless system.

YES - A new fork which has a sufficiently long steerer tube is required. New forks typically are made for threadless stems, and have no threads on the steerer tube. One can employ a used fork from a (much) larger bike that has a sufficiently long steer tube. However, any threaded upper portion of the used fork must be cut off. In this conversion, a threadless headset will be required.

CAUTION - You should NOT attach the threadless stem to the threaded portion of a fork's steerer tube. The steerer tube may (will) break at the threads. This can result in a dramatic alteration of the rider's appearance.

YES - There is an adapter one can buy that has a quill at one end and a cylinder at the other. The quill is inserted into the steerer tube and tightened. The threadless stem is clamped onto the cylindrical end. These threadless stem adapters are available at most bike shops or on the Internet at places like performancebike.com or nashbar.com. Cost is about $20.

UPGRADING FROM A DOUBLE TO TRIPLE CRANK

This is a common upgrade for people living in hilly areas. It can be done by replacing a double crank with a triple crank or by attaching a triple chainring adapter, a triplizer, to the existing double crank. Information on tripleizers (triple chainring adapters) , has been provided here by Don Gillies.

What new/used parts do you need to replace a double crank with a triple?

• Triple right crank
• L onger bottom bracket axle or new bottom bracket
• W ide range rear derailleur (either a road triple or mountain bike triple)
• Longer chain
• STI or Ergo triple front shifter or a friction shifter capable of handling a triple (most can).
• A new front derailleur may be needed if: 1. the existing one doesn't have enough range to shift to the inner and outer rings, or 2. if the chain drags on the tail of the derailleur when in the small ring.

If you want to use a small inner ring, less than 30 teeth or so, (touring over the Rockies, stump pulling or just peace of mind) and a large ring of 50 teeth or more, a new front derailleur with a long tail will probably be required. Here are some suggestions for long-tailed front derailleurs (all no longer made): Huret Duo Par, Huret Pilot, SunTour Cyclone MK II, Simplex SJA 522, Simplex SJA 102, Shimano N-600, SunTour Mountech. A Campagnolo Super Record front will work with inner rings down to about 28 teeth.

Drew Saunders has detailed information on making a double to triple conversion. http://www.stanford.edu/~dru/tripleize.html . This page also describes the use of the " tripleizer " chain ring.

A Campagnolo Nuovo or Super Record double crank arm can be converted to a triple by drilling and tapping the crank arm to accept a 74mm BCD inner chainring. It requires some precision, so don't try it with a hand drill. Various shops can do it for you, including Elliott Bay Bicycles in Seattle.

An alternative to a new bottom bracket is to add a longer axle to the existing cup and cone bottom bracket. It may not be easy to determining the length needed. See Sheldon Brown's Bottom Bracket Size Database for a discussion of this problem: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/bbsize.html . Vintage Trek road bike bottom bracket shells are the English/Japanese standard 68mm wide. Used parts can be found at bicycle swap meets, used bike shops, or on eBay.com

If you are able to find a vintage used road triple crank, you may have a challenge finding a bottom bracket or crank axle of the right length. See Sheldon Brown's site, http://www.sheldonbrown.com/bbsize.html , for guidance.

For a vintage Trek, a common setup is to find a used Sugino AT crankset (triple) and use a Shimano UN52 or UN72 or UN73 sealed bottom bracket with 127.5mm axle. This may require a 2mm spacer on the right bottom bracket end to provide sufficient spacing between the small ring and the chainstay. The spacer is typically available at your local bike shop.

One possible solution to the crank axle length problem is to take the crank and bike to your local bike shop. Ask them to sell you a new bottom bracket and install it for you. It is likely the will have only Shimano sealed bottom brackets to choose from. They may have to do some trial an error fitting, trying a few bottom brackets until they come up with one that works. Let them know that using a 1mm or 2mm spacer on the right side is OK.

ADDING MORE REAR COGS OR CONVERTING TO INDEX SHIFTING

Vintage Treks typically came with 5 or 6 or 7 rear cogs. More modern rear hubs have 8, 9 or 10 cogs. Can an old Trek be modified to have more cogs? Yes, but it does take some money and work.

First, you must decide on the number of rear gears you want. If you want more than 8 gears in the rear, it is likely you will need a new crank. A 9 speed chain will likely fall between the chainwheels. A 10 speed chain is more of a problem.

A modern Shimano road hub with 130mm spacing can take a 8, 9 or 10 speed cassette. With a commercially-available spacer, the hub can be used with a 7 speed cassette. This road hub requires 130mm rear dropout spacing (see the Spreading Rear Dropouts section below).

Campagnolo and Shimano components are generally not compatible with each other if index shifting (click shifting) is your goal. Campy or Shimano rear shifters will not work with the other's rear derailleurs or cassettes. (An exception is that 9 speed hubs/wheels can be used, imperfectly, with the other's equipment.) Cassettes of one manufacturer will not fit on the other's rear hubs. However, Campy and Shimano front shifters and derailleurs are usually compatible.

If you are going to buy new road components of a single manufacturer, the components will be compatible, if a common speed (8, 9 or 10) for the parts is specified. If you are going to use components of different years and models, there are some incompatibilities of which you should be aware. The book "Zinn and the Art of Road Bike Maintenance" by Leonard Zinn contains details of these problems.

What is needed to convert from a freewheel hub (5, 6, or 7 speeds) to a cassette hub system with index shifting?

• A rear hub capable of carrying a cassette with the targeted number of gears. (This usually entails buying a new wheel.)
• A cassette with the desired number of cogs, that matches the new rear hub.
• New shifters that are made for the number of cogs on the cassette.
• Cable stops to replace the downtube shifters (if you are using integrated brake lever/shifters [AKA brifters] or barcon [bar end] shifters).
• New rear derailleur designed for index shifting. A caution - a rear derailleur designed for a lower number of cogs (e.g. 7) will shift cogs with more gears, BUT - there may not be clearance between the derailleur and the spokes.
• Front derailleur designed for index shifting. If you want to friction shift, almost any front derailleur will work.
• New chain designed for the targeted number of cogs in the cassette. A modern 8 speed chain will also work with 5, 6, or 7 speed cogs. Nine cogs require 9 speed chains; ten cogs require 10 speed chains.

If your bike has brazed-on bosses for downtube shifters, to convert from 5 or 6 speed shifters you probably can find 7 (or rarely, 8) speed Shimano indexed downtube shifters that will fit.

Many conversions use Shimano bar end (also called barcon) indexed shifters. They were available in 7 and 8 speeds (find used or NOS on eBay.com). Nine-speed barcons are still available new. Bar-end shifters avoid the expense of STI integrated brake levers/shifters and allows you to keep your current brake levers. They require replacing your downtube shifters with downtube cable stops.

A caution - some downtube clamp-on shifter bosses made for friction shifting, that may be on your lower to mid-level Trek bike, are not compatible with standard shifters that fit on brazed-on bosses. Downtube cable stops also will not fit on these nonstandard types of clamp-on bosses. Types that do not work are various Shimano ones, including Shimano 600, and many by SunTour. Old Campagnolo Nuovo/Super Record clamp-on bosses work fine as do Shimano clamp-on bosses made for index shifting.

A shifter alternative is to use a brifter for shifting the rear derailleur, but a downtube shifter for the front. A regular brake lever can be used for the front brake. This weight-saving setup was often used by Lance on his climbing bike. Also, with this method you can use your existing non-indexing front derailleur and non-indexing downtube shifter.

Here are three innovative shifter alternatives that can facilitate upgrading or modernizing an old bike:

The Kelly Takeoff is: "A simple, low cost alternative to integrated shifting. Lightweight chromoly. Mounts simply. Uses your conventional shifters & aero/non-aero brake levers. Great for retrofits." Paul Component Engineering Thumbies thumb shifter mounts: "These are designed to be used with indexed Shimano bar-end (aka barcon) shifters. Both 9-speed and 8-speed indexed shifters are readily available, and these shifters also still have a friction option for everything else." Bar-end Shifter Mounts from Rivendell Bicycle Works . "If you have regular downtube shifters that you want to convert to bar-enders, you need these. Most shifters work on them. Not all, but most." CONVERTING FROM 27" DIAMETER WHEELS TO 700C WHEELS Many older Treks came with 27" diameter wheels/tires. More modern bikes use 700C wheels/tires. A common question is: "Can I simply replace my 27" wheels with 700C"? The answer is yes, if your brake pads can be lowered in their slots by 4mm or more. This is usually the case. A practical test is to borrow a set of 700C wheels and try them. If the pads cannot be lowered that much, the brakes calipers will have to be replaced with others that allow this much reach. There are plenty of good 27" tires available at road bike shops or on the Internet. Touring, commuting, and training tire availability is not a problem; lots of choices. Why change from 27" to 700C? Three reasons: 1. You want to use racing clincher tires. The selection and availability of lightweight skinny tires in 700C is huge. 2. You want to use tubular tires (which are not available in 27" diameter). 3. If you think 27" wheels/tires are old fashioned or your riding buddies give you grief.

SPREADING REAR DROPOUTS

Early Vintage Treks, 1976 to 1982 (or so), have a rear dropout spacing of 120mm. After 82, spacing increased to 126mm to accommodate 6 or 7 speed hubs. With a bit of effort (or $) you can bend the stays on your steel Trek to increase the spacing to work with modern hubs. Modern spacing is 130mm for 8, 9 or 10 speed (road hubs). One can even spread to 135mm to employ the extra strength of mountain bike rear hubs. This is common for touring bikes.

CAUTION: Only steel frames can be safely spread. Aluminum and carbon frames should not be spread as they tend to break or be damaged, not bend. Additionally, frames of Reynolds 753 steel tubing (such as the Trek Model 170) should not be spread. The forces required are so high that damage to the frame (or the person bending) is likely.

Unfortunately, there is some (but minor) risk involved in permanently bending a frame; the brake bridge or chainstay bridge can pop, leaving you with junk or an expensive repair job. An experienced bike shop can do the spreading, but usually with the proviso that is is at your risk.

One do-it-yourself method employs an 8" or longer piece of allthread, two nuts, and two washers. Allthread is a continuously-threaded rod available in most hardware stores. Use either 5/16" or 3/8" diameter. The allthread is placed in the dropouts and the nuts are turned outward to spread the dropouts. The washers go between the nuts and the dropouts. Lubricate the allthread to make the process easier.

You must spread well beyond the target width to get the stays to bend. It is an iterative process. Screw the dropouts out a bit, measure the spread, unscrew the allthread, and measure the result. If no permanent spreading is accomplished, spread again, going a bit farther. Repeat this process until the target is reached. Use care, there is little distance between spreading with no permanent bending and spreading with permanent bending. If you do go beyond the target width, use the allthread in reverse to bend the dropouts back together. Columbus tubing is commonly thought to be the most difficult to bend, followed by Ishiwata and then Reynolds 531.

I wrap the bridges with many turns of string and/or strapping tape to help assure they do not pop. However, realize that the tape or string can damage the paint. One can use the string method described by Sheldon Brown (see below) to check alignment after the spreading. Most Trek frames do not have dimpled chainstays, so spreading using the allthread method tends to spread the stays uniformly, and does not significantly affect alignment.

A final test of alignment is whether you can ride the bike with no hands and have the bike go straight with both bike and rider vertical.

More frame spreading information is available at Sheldon Brown's site http://sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html . He suggests an alternative method for spreading, employing a wooden 2 x 4. However, the 2 x 4 method can misalign the entire rear triangle. If this happens, one can use the allthread in reverse to keep the dropouts from spreading apart while using the 2 x 4 to twist the rear triangle back into alignment.

After spreading the dropouts, a good frame shop will align the dropout faces to make them parallel. They will have a tool just for this purpose. For the do-it-yourselfer, this is not normally necessary. Non parallel dropouts are often cited as a cause of axle breakage, at least for freewheel-type hubs. However, with the wide bearing location of modern cassette hubs, the problem is not encountered.

A shortcut, useful for going from 126mm to 130mm, is not to permanently spread the frame. When you install the 130mm hub, just pull apart the dropouts to make it fit. Not very elegant, but works just fine.

IS IT COLUMBUS TUBING?

Is the tubing on your frame Columbus? If so, the steerer tube outer surface would probably have a little Columbus dove stamped on it. Also, if Columbus, the lower portion of inside of the steerer tube will typically have "ridges" or "rifling". (The inner surface of the top of the tube will be smooth to accept the stem.) If either is the case, the fork tubing is almost certainly Columbus. If the fork is original, the rest of the frame is almost certainly Columbus. However, if either the dove or the rifling are missing, it is not proof it is not Columbus, but it likely is not.

On vintage Treks, the Cinelli bottom bracket (with cast in "Cinelli") was more commonly used with Columbus tubing. However, it is not a reliable indicator as it also was used with Reynolds 531 tubing.

SOURCES OF GENERAL VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHT INFORMATION HOW TO CONTACT TREK TECHNICAL SUPPORT HOW TO FIND VINTAGE BIKE PARTS BASIC SPECS FOR VINTAGE TREK STEEL ROAD BIKES STEEL TUBING SPECS FOR EARLY TREKS HELICOMATIC HUBS PAINT TREK DECALS PAINT TOUCH UP INTERNAL RUSTPROOFING OF A FRAME THREADING THE DERAILLEUR CABLE THROUGH THE CHAINSTAY CONVERTING FROM A QUILL STEM TO A MODERN THREADLESS STEM ADDING MORE REAR COGS OR CONVERTING TO INDEX SHIFTING UPGRADING FROM A DOUBLE TO TRIPLE CRANK CONVERTING FROM 27" DIAMETER WHEELS TO 700C WHEELS SPREADING REAR DROPOUTS IS IT COLUMBUS TUBING?

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